Hype?

[drezmagic]

I'd like to say that I'm excited about theory 11, and I think it's off to a great start!

I do have one thing to say though... One thing I never like about ellusionist was the way they over hyped their products: "shatter reality, break into your spectators mind and alter the universe!" or "pull a card through glass using slow surgery!"

I really hope theory 11 doesn't become like this. I might be sounding kind of nit-picky but I think unlike Ellusionist, theory 11 should let the tricks speak for themselves.

I'm looking forward to seeing more great effects from this site

 

[Dave]

I'd like to say that I'm excited about theory 11, and I think it's off to a great start!

I do have one thing to say though... One thing I never like about ellusionist was the way they over hyped their products: "shatter reality, break into your spectators mind and alter the universe!" or "pull a card through glass using slow surgery!"

I really hope theory 11 doesn't become like this. I might be sounding kind of nit-picky but I think unlike Ellusionist, theory 11 should let the tricks speak for themselves.

I'm looking forward to seeing more great effects from this site

This is a great point. I am glad to see someone posted this, it needed to be addressed.

 

[Steerpike]

I might be sounding kind of nit-picky but I think unlike Ellusionist, theory 11 should let the tricks speak for themselves.

That only works with people who are already magicians. Beginners coming her to get their first taste of magic want to see all the hype and zazz and sound bites and quotes and testimonials.

If you live in this generation and still aren't media savvy enough to take hype with a grain of salt, then it's your own fault.

 

[Dave]

That only works with people who are already magicians. Beginners coming her to get their first taste of magic want to see all the hype and zazz and sound bites and quotes and testimonials.

If you live in this generation and still aren't media savvy enough to take hype with a grain of salt, then it's your own fault.

Good point. Though I think for some people it is more of a handicap then
it being their fault.

 

[Steerpike]

I'm speaking generally of course. We live in a culture of mass media, so we owe it to ourselves to become more media savvy.

My point stands however that the hype is intended for the beginners who want all the fanfare. When I first started out with Ellusionist, I wanted to see all the reviews and quotes and whatnot. I wanted to see the photos and videos. I knew to take the slogans with a grain of salt, and I knew that it was all marketing. But I wanted to know that they took it seriously. Given the reputation they seemed to have, I knew there had to be something behind all the bravado. Something had to make all this marketing worth it.

To say, "Let the trick speak for itself," doesn't work on the beginner. They don't have the same frame of mind that we do, and I can state without any doubt that most magicians forget that.

 

[drezmagic]

That only works with people who are already magicians. Beginners coming her to get their first taste of magic want to see all the hype and zazz and sound bites and quotes and testimonials.

If you live in this generation and still aren't media savvy enough to take hype with a grain of salt, then it's your own fault.

I'm not saying that there should not be any hype, just not overly dramatic. I think beginners who are truly interested will get the tricks they want- regardless of the dramatic description. I do take hype with a grain of salt, but I think theory 11 shouldnt become a carbon copy of ellusionist. When I started out, I bought from a website that didn't have much hype at all. When I visited Ellusionist and saw "shift reality in your spectators mind" I felt that it was a company only interested in my money and not in actually teaching me tricks.

 

[Steerpike]

I'm not saying that there should not be any hype, just not overly dramatic.

But people want the drama. Even if the know it's just marketing, it's exciting nevertheless.

I felt that it was a company only interested in my money and not in actually teaching me tricks.

Then you must be overly suspicious of a lot of businesses.

 

[drezmagic]

But people want the drama. Even if the know it's just marketing, it's exciting nevertheless.



Then you must be overly suspicious of a lot of businesses.

I know people want the hype, and I think it is sometimes a good thing. I just hope that theory 11 doesn't become the hype monster with the descriptions like ellusionist...

 

[Steerpike]

If you're an experienced media savvy magician, what difference would it make to you?

 

[Guardian452]

to draw begginers we need E's type of videos

show 3 seconds of the trick, then show people screaming and reacting, then say that the trick is amazing.

we need to ACTUALLY show the effect on the demo. video

its a pain in the ass to see demo video like distortion.

those videos suck, dont help anyone, and wont sell anybody to buy it unless they are a begginer.

i dont buy an effect until i know what it looks like

 

[therealsuperman13]

i just hope the methods to alot of T11 tricks don't involve spit.

cuz there have been alot of those lately on E.

 

[drezmagic]

to draw begginers we need E's type of videos

show 3 seconds of the trick, then show people screaming and reacting, then say that the trick is amazing.

we need to ACTUALLY show the effect on the demo. video

its a pain in the ass to see demo video like distortion.

those videos suck, dont help anyone, and wont sell anybody to buy it unless they are a begginer.

i dont buy an effect until i know what it looks like

thank you, that's exactly my point. I think even if they showed the whole trick and it looked amazing, an interested beginner would get it. Instead of using dramatic marketing slogans, and 3 second videos, theory 11 should let the magic sell the effect- not the advertisment.

 

[Steerpike]

thank you, that's exactly my point. I think even if they showed the whole trick and it looked amazing, an interested beginner would get it. Instead of using dramatic marketing slogans, and 3 second videos, theory 11 should let the magic sell the effect- not the advertisment.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they do that with Sinful? And the same people who wanted more of those videos cried foul when the exposure monkeys used it to reverse engineer the effect?

Don't magicians on TV edit out portions of the effect where critical moves could be exposed? Isn't the standard now supposed to be focusing on audience reactions?

I'm sick of hearing that ridiculous meme "Let the art speak for itself." I'm willing to bet half of you don't even know what that means.

 

[SilkenRazors]

Sometimes tricks need to be edited out in order to keep the critical moves hidden, yes.

Now, as for Sinful, c'mon.. anyone who sat down and thought about that for a couple of minutes could figure it out.

Peoples reactions do seem to be where everything is going these days, which is kinda sad. I'd like to see the effect and react for myself. Just because some stoned guy is all "Wow, man... wow." doesn't make me want to buy the effect, but watching Daniel Garcia actually move the symbol on the dollar bill certainly did!

 

[Matt]

i just hope the methods to alot of T11 tricks don't involve spit.

cuz there have been alot of those lately on E.

hey... watch it now thats a little bit of exposure there....

 

[Steerpike]

Now, as for Sinful, c'mon.. anyone who sat down and thought about that for a couple of minutes could figure it out.

I didn't. At least not for a while I didn't.

Peoples reactions do seem to be where everything is going these days, which is kinda sad. I'd like to see the effect and react for myself. Just because some stoned guy is all "Wow, man... wow." doesn't make me want to buy the effect, but watching Daniel Garcia actually move the symbol on the dollar bill certainly did!

Again, you're thinking like a magician. The teaser trailers are made more for the beginners than us. And I believe that's important. Rotating new blood into the scene is one of the most critical aspects in the health of magic.

Everybody cries foul when a trailer shows only the reveal instead of the full routine, but if the full routine was shown you'd complain about that too.

 

[Guardian452]

if they edit it out, then how will we know the effect??

its like if all you see is a card in your hands outstretchd in front of you, a flash of light with MTV music, then a blurred to more sharpened focus on his backpocket, the video cuts 5 time to get the wallet out, once it gets out of the pocket, another flash of light, 6 flashes to open up his wallet, then there is a card. then show 5 people screaming.


thats the videos

you think people are going to buy an effect by seeing that??

of course, because the newer generation and some magicinas who have been in the art of magic for a while, will buy an effect knowing nothing of what it looks like

 

[drezmagic]

One thing I feel is wrong with almost every magic forum I've been to is that when someone speaks his mind, and entire argument blows up. We are all mature magicians (I hope so), and we all have our own opinions. It does not mean that someone's view is better than the other. We are just expressing our feelings and opinions, I hope the theory 11 forum is a successful place where magicians can HELP each other and speak their mind without being attacked.

 

[Guardian452]

whos attacking who??

we are voicing our opions as well

even if we come off more aggresive, if you cant take it on a forum, then grow up

 

[Steerpike]

We are just expressing our feelings and opinions, I hope the theory 11 forum is a successful place where magicians can HELP each other and speak their mind without being attacked.

Yes, speak your mind. Unless it's to argue or say something contrary, then you're a wanker who's just attacking people.

I'm just blunt and sarcastic. If you take that as an attack, you're very thin-skinned. Clearly, I'm doing a bad job of getting my point across or you would have figured out that I'm not attacking people at all.