Modern Magic vs. Past Magic

[AllanLuu]

Magic has been around for centuries.

In the time of Harry Houdini, they use to do tricks such as cutting people in half, the traditional straightjacket escape and many others.

Now, we do tricks with ziploc bags, double stick tape and many other objects and tools.

Now magic has one real definition:

Magic: the art of producing illusions as entertainment by the use of sleight of hand, deceptive devices, etc.; legerdemain; conjuring: to pull a rabbit out of a hat by magic.

I feel that modern magic is really "lazy". What I mean by that is that many of the newer kids in magic are so use to gimmicks doing the magic for them. Sure they know a double lift or a tilt, but can they do them well?

I can probably guesse in the Houdini times, you really had to practice hard, sure there were gimmciks that inhanced your show, but alot of the stuff takes real skill.

What do you guys feel about this?

P.S. This is not regarding everyone , this is just a topic for discussion.

 

[lachomagician]

I think these are changing times. Information and technology allow people to know what used to be ancient secrets of performers and magicians. Now we have to make magic more "raw," perhaps even more impossible, for people to be impressed. But many of us have forgotten about the real roots of magic. Magic is nothing without an audience. We are there to entertain and amaze, and many of us are focused on "being cool" or "getting noticed." I really love what Wayne said on his latest Control Podcast. He talked about how people reacted on a deeper level when Control was performed. This is what we should aim for. If we connect with our audience, they forget about knowing what a double lift is. They will watch tricks for what they are: illusions created for entertainment. If we get our audience on our side through our personality (where being ourselves really counts) then we can quickly eliminate some of the common problems we encounter (hecklers, people forgetting their cards, threats about looking things up) and we create a relationship with complete strangers. I think many of us have become lazy as performers. Techniques can still take time to develop, but we need to go out there and perform, talk to strangers, even if it is not about magic. Do not forget, magic should be a reflection of who we are, it should not be who we are.

Juan M.

 

[jimbowmanjr]

What you are considering as past magic is still performed regularly in modern times. I am sure you could come up with countless other examples and each of them are also performed in modern times with possible twists on them.

I think the topic you are generally concerned with is the attitude and approach to magic that has been taken on in recent times. The lack of preparation, practice, studying, presentation, and showmanship are all glaring deficiencies in many modern effects and performances.

Just as in modern times there were most certainly plenty of poor performers in the past during the period you specified that Houdini was around. Given the capability to instantly transmit those poor performances worldwide via YouTube it has simply become more visible and apparent to those of us watching.

Just yesterday I sat and watched Fred Kaps performances for about an hour or two. Now his style may not suit everyones taste but you can hardly argue that his presence and skill cannot be overlooked. I personally love his style, grace, presentation, and showmanship that he brings to the table. You can tell that he put countless hours into honing his skill and preparing for each and every effect he performs.

Then I flip over to YouTube_Magician_01 who learned an effect 10 minutes ago and couldn't wait to post up a video of their performance for all the world to see. The gap between these two is immeasurable and it has nothing to do with skill if you think about it. It has to do with effort and transforming desire into passion. Take that passion and WORK on something, really work on it instead of half-assing it and hoping it will be good enough. I am not generalizing every person who puts up a YouTube video either. There are guys out there who put up videos, be it flourishing or pure magic, that have clearly worked their ass off to perfect and present to the world or even perform for a live audience.

I am not trying to say you should do things one way or the other or that your performance should be on par with a performer like Fred Kaps, or that you should even emulate him. I am simply saying you should at least give the appearance that you put in the effort to make your presentation of an effect the best it could have possibly been. If you can look back on a performance and honestly tell yourself "that was the best I could have done" then that is all you can ask of yourself.

--Jim

 

[SHANE BLACK]

What you are considering as past magic is still performed regularly in modern times. I am sure you could come up with countless other examples and each of them are also performed in modern times with possible twists on them.

I think the topic you are generally concerned with is the attitude and approach to magic that has been taken on in recent times. The lack of preparation, practice, studying, presentation, and showmanship are all glaring deficiencies in many modern effects and performances.

Just as in modern times there were most certainly plenty of poor performers in the past during the period you specified that Houdini was around. Given the capability to instantly transmit those poor performances worldwide via YouTube it has simply become more visible and apparent to those of us watching.

Just yesterday I sat and watched Fred Kaps performances for about an hour or two. Now his style may not suit everyones taste but you can hardly argue that his presence and skill cannot be overlooked. I personally love his style, grace, presentation, and showmanship that he brings to the table. You can tell that he put countless hours into honing his skill and preparing for each and every effect he performs.

Then I flip over to YouTube_Magician_01 who learned an effect 10 minutes ago and couldn't wait to post up a video of their performance for all the world to see. The gap between these two is immeasurable and it has nothing to do with skill if you think about it. It has to do with effort and transforming desire into passion. Take that passion and WORK on something, really work on it instead of half-assing it and hoping it will be good enough. I am not generalizing every person who puts up a YouTube video either. There are guys out there who put up videos, be it flourishing or pure magic, that have clearly worked their ass off to perfect and present to the world or even perform for a live audience.

I am not trying to say you should do things one way or the other or that your performance should be on par with a performer like Fred Kaps, or that you should even emulate him. I am simply saying you should at least give the appearance that you put in the effort to make your presentation of an effect the best it could have possibly been. If you can look back on a performance and honestly tell yourself "that was the best I could have done" then that is all you can ask of yourself.

--Jim

This is the best response I've read in a longtime. This has been a growing problem with the the internet access to the media now a days. When I see a youtube performance of another magi's effect I look for many different things. First, how did the the performer change the effect to fit their style. (I think this is why most of us watch others perform the effects we know). Second, I look at presentation and all around smoothness. Now I myself have learned what not to do as well by watching someone else and thats helped me but not to get off topic. I think the relevance and impact of past magic is more than ever alive right now in almost everything that is created. Saying that I don't think modern magic has necessarily become lazy I would say it's become convenient and more compatible. The future is more realistic illusions on the street and it's time for us to evolve. Without change everything dies and it's important for us as magicians not to let that happen.

Shane.

 

[robotsunshine]

I find most younger magicians relying on sleight-of-hand than I do gimmicks. They generally want something they can do immediately. I've seen a lot of new magicians even swearing off gimmicks, saying that their routines are impromptu and sleight-of-hand only (these people tend to have a very small arsenal of tricks). The only problem is that Youtube magicians and inexperienced, newer magicians generally can't perform any sleights well.

I'm reminded of a video I saw of someone doing Garcia's Ego Change: unable to actually perform it smoothly, he simply raised his right hand up to the camera for cover for about seven seconds, completely blocking the deck, his hands, and, well, everything. He then removed his hand, showing the right card on top.

The good thing is that these people only perform for their cameras, and will eventually get bored of going nowhere in the magic world, unable to find exposure videos for the tricks they want, thus leaving magic as just a passing phase. Those of us who actually perform will continue to thrive, and expand. At least, that's how I see it.

 

[SHANE BLACK]

I find most younger magicians relying on sleight-of-hand than I do gimmicks. They generally want something they can do immediately. I've seen a lot of new magicians even swearing off gimmicks, saying that their routines are impromptu and sleight-of-hand only (these people tend to have a very small arsenal of tricks). The only problem is that Youtube magicians and inexperienced, newer magicians generally can't perform any sleights well.

I'm reminded of a video I saw of someone doing Garcia's Ego Change: unable to actually perform it smoothly, he simply raised his right hand up to the camera for cover for about seven seconds, completely blocking the deck, his hands, and, well, everything. He then removed his hand, showing the right card on top.

The good thing is that these people only perform for their cameras, and will eventually get bored of going nowhere in the magic world, unable to find exposure videos for the tricks they want, thus leaving magic as just a passing phase. Those of us who actually perform will continue to thrive, and expand. At least, that's how I see it.

Amen!
Word count.

 

[AllanLuu]

I find most younger magicians relying on sleight-of-hand than I do gimmicks. They generally want something they can do immediately. I've seen a lot of new magicians even swearing off gimmicks, saying that their routines are impromptu and sleight-of-hand only (these people tend to have a very small arsenal of tricks). The only problem is that Youtube magicians and inexperienced, newer magicians generally can't perform any sleights well.

I'm reminded of a video I saw of someone doing Garcia's Ego Change: unable to actually perform it smoothly, he simply raised his right hand up to the camera for cover for about seven seconds, completely blocking the deck, his hands, and, well, everything. He then removed his hand, showing the right card on top.

The good thing is that these people only perform for their cameras, and will eventually get bored of going nowhere in the magic world, unable to find exposure videos for the tricks they want, thus leaving magic as just a passing phase. Those of us who actually perform will continue to thrive, and expand. At least, that's how I see it.

Amen to that, but then there is the other question,

Is the newer population of magic doing it for youtube?

 

[MitchellStafiej]

Post-Modernism my friend.

Here's the thing, with time comes change. Change is inevitable. Look at the car, look at the telephone, look at the television. Every one of these things have changed in one way or another. Magic can be seen this way as well. We are always trying to find something new or an easier way to do something. It's normal to expect change and I don't think it's fair to compare the magic of the past to today's magic because there will obviously be major differences.

Mitchell

 

[CDarklock]

Is the newer population of magic doing it for youtube?

Magic has definitely changed over the years, but let's not forget that close-up magic is documented as dating back to the 15th century (ms. by Jacobus de Cessolis, ca. 1407) and probably goes back much further. Modern street magic is very much going back to those roots, where effects - whether gimmicked or not - are performed for smaller audiences in largely impromptu venues.

What I hope we're not reviving is the practice of pickpocketing the audience while they're focused on watching the magic.

YouTube provides an interesting venue for magic. You have an audience of one - the camera - and complete control over distance and angle. You have all the time in the world to set up and clean up. If you screw up the trick, you can try again, as many times as you like. And after you complete that one perfect performance for an audience of one that never says or does anything to screw up your trick, you can upload it free to a spot where millions of people can go see it. It's reaching a massive audience as though it were a single person.

That's amazing. It's incredible. The possibilities are fantastic. So why are we complaining about it?

Well, because all of these things that make it possible for a real magician to do an amazing trick... also make it easier for a hack magician to do a crap trick.

But what's changed? Honestly, haven't hack magicians always been around? Haven't they always outnumbered the serious magicians? Haven't the public always been largely unable to tell the difference? What is the real difference?

My speculation is that we've now started to feel the same thing every performance art feels: the deep, sick feeling that somewhere - right now - someone who is not as good as you are is making more money. Until recently, magicians have been very different, eccentric sorts of figures. They still are, to an extent.

But David Blaine could have been a guy in your school. Criss Angel could have been the guy next to you at that Avenged Sevenfold concert. Wayne Houchin could be an altarboy at your church. Daniel Madison could be the guy at the corner bus stop. You can believe that these are real people who live in your neighborhood. Magicians and magic are accessible now. The magic shop isn't a seedy little hole in the wall located in a bad part of town anymore; it's in your living room, thanks to the internet.

And that's where magic has really changed with the introduction of street magic; we've brought it from the back room of an exclusive club, the high-rise stage of a majestic theatre, and we've put it in your neighborhood.

Magicians are out there, right now. We're in your schools, your offices, your suburbs and cities and slums. We're Childe Harold in Byron's epic. Among them, but not of them; in a shroud of thoughts which are not their thoughts. And that concept can be taken to a very dark place indeed.

But it reaches heights, as well. You can't dwell on the failures and flaws of the common mountebank; sure, he outnumbers us. We're special. We're not like him. What we do takes more time, energy, effort, and just plain skill than he or his kind can muster. Don't worry that the sheep who follow him are lost to you; they're sheep. You'll capture their attention every bit as easily, and more besides. What begins to drive you, more than capturing the sheep, is capturing your own - having another magician quietly ask you how the hell you did that.

That's what really kicks ass about this craft, or profession, or art. That's never changed. And it never will.

 

[SHANE BLACK]

Well said.

Word count.

 

[Steerpike]

I feel that modern magic is really "lazy". What I mean by that is that many of the newer kids in magic are so use to gimmicks doing the magic for them. Sure they know a double lift or a tilt, but can they do them well?

There have always been bad magicians. Nobody remembers them because they sucked.

 

[copperfield 14]

What is a youtube magician. Is it a magician who posts videos on youtube or is it something else. Also alot of you guys are not the best at tricks. I've seen people on these forums act like they are really good and they say kids at youtube suck. Well most of you guys aren't that great either. Just speeking towards everyone.

 

[ThrallMind]

What is a youtube magician. Is it a magician who posts videos on youtube or is it something else. Also alot of you guys are not the best at tricks. I've seen people on these forums act like they are really good and they say kids at youtube suck. Well most of you guys aren't that great either. Just speeking towards everyone.

First off, bad form, attacking all the members at once. Second off...

A YouTube magician is someone who learns an effect, either by buying it or illegally acquiring it, then as soon as they practice once, thinks they have it down and posts the video of it on YouTube, exposing it unintentionally.

The members here (I'm sure the majority), even if not the best out there as you say, practice as much as they can before performing. This means they are, at the least, TRYING to do the best they can and not trying to trivialize the art.

-ThrallMind

 

[copperfield 14]

First off, bad form, attacking all the members at once. Second off...

A YouTube magician is someone who learns an effect, either by buying it or illegally acquiring it, then as soon as they practice once, thinks they have it down and posts the video of it on YouTube, exposing it unintentionally.

The members here (I'm sure the majority), even if not the best out there as you say, practice as much as they can before performing. This means they are, at the least, TRYING to do the best they can and not trying to trivialize the art.

-ThrallMind

I wasn't trying to attack anyone when I said this goes to everyone. I mean't that the message would be heard not only to the people in this thread (since some are pretty good at magic)but to the everyone. Some people just bash on others even though they know they suck. Sorry if anyone took it a bit the wrong way.

 

[robotsunshine]

Still, there are those of us who can't do Three Fly to save our life - yet, when we see one on Youtube, and it's terrible, we bash them or criticize. And we do that not because it's a bad performance, but because they're bad magicians: all their tricks on their channel are poorly executed with Linkin Park loudly blaring over the speakers. The video itself lasts only 30 seconds. They never speak in it. Their poor sleights make you groan. And then, half of their other videos are exposure vids on Paul Harris card tricks. That's why we criticize. Some of us may not be wonderful technicians ourselves, but we have the common sense to know to practice and change that, and to work hard on an actual performance.

If they simply needed more practice, they probably wouldn't draw the hate. Getting constructive criticism for your efforts from someone who knows what they're talking about is a great thing.

Someone who just completely disrespects what we're trying to do with awful presentations, no practice, and exposure videos naturally draws our ire.

 

[AllanLuu]

I would lie3k to point out that another form of a youtube magician is somone that gets a trick or learns a trick and within an hour has a video of it on youtube.

Makes me sick to my stomach quite honestly.

And when they comment your video saying that your doulbe lift sucks or somthing like that, you can see that they probably can't do it because if they could they would give you advice, whcih is probably not mean't to be posted on a public video but you get the point.