Motion. Flow and speed.

[Sinful07]

Ive recently stumbled upon a video uploaded by a theory11 member named 'PullusGallinaceus'. The Flourish video was quite standard. A Torso shot of someone fiddling around with a deck of cards making fancy shapes and movements.

*you can find it here* http://media.theory11.com/2147-Flirt

Anyways, onto my point:

I wanted to talk about Speed and Fluidity when it comes to flourishes.

I'll use Mr Pullus' video as an example. The second flourish that he performs (Straight after 'Flirt') is what stunned me.

When i first saw the flourish, my jaw dropped. it looked absoloutely animated, and left me wanting for more. i immediately replayed the video and watched the flourish again. it looked familiar. it was a modified version of Andrei's 'B4' cut.

I sat back. All this time ive been practicing B4, trying to get it as fast as i can, when all the while there was a more beautiful way of presenting the flourish.

Slow it down. I slowed my B4 and the results are breath taking. It gave me more time to appreciate as to why i make these funny shapes and twirls with playing cards.

There's my accidental observation. Oh and please, try to avoid comments as to 'prefering slowness because its your style'. Frankly, we both know that you're doing it slow, because you cant do it fast. (like me and my Pandora. haaaaa.) Looking back, one video in particular pops into my head as well, which would be Kate's 'Slow it down' video. Its basically just her performing a couple of basic flourishes, but everything is slowed down to a tee- It was a bit dissapointing that a myriad of theory11 members commented negatively by saying that it wasnt anything spectacular. That wasnt the point.

Hopefully you guys have read all that and will take away something. Its not something that i expect everyone to understand, but moreso at least try. It is a vital idea to remember when flourishing, performing magic or appreciating life in general.

Slow=Smooth.

Take time to appreciate. its not about speed. Slow it down.

 

[SamRochon]

Slow=Smooth.

Like Brian Tudor, but in reverse

 

[Leon]

Actually,

PullusGallinaceus didn't perform the move slow at all. But he did pay attention to one little detail.

When he flares out the packets in that B4 variation, he turns his body so that you can see the packets that are being flared out. In this case, its not about how slowly or smoothly he does it, it is about the way he presents the move.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Speed does is not the most important factor. Smothness counts, you are right. But speed is important because you wouldn't want someone who can perform the Leon cut as smooth as butter, but takes 30 seconds to finish the display. That's way too long.

 

[copperfield 14]

Smooth=Slow. I don't know why everyone constantly ignores this. When you slow down a flourish you can enjoy it more. See things you can't see if the flourish was done at speed.

 

[Zeedub81]

Personally, the faster, more intense flourishes are what I like. I will admit, some flourishes do look better slow/smooth, but that's not really what got me into cardistry.

 

[UnknownMagician93]

Check ouy Kevin Ho's "Void Deck" on his website. Perfect example...

 

[michael_weiss]

You know I'm not a big fan of flourishing, I do a little hear and there, but I agree as said before, presentation is key along with fluidity of the flourish/and or cut. Also someone can slow down a flourish an still make it beautiful, course not taking 30 seconds to do it...but it should be an even balance of skill, presentation, speed, and timing.

 

[visualartist]

Why not,in some sequence of a flourish,do it fast and almost instantly ,as if in slow-mo,slow down.
Gives whatever flourish you do some originality,maybe.

 

[wildermagic]

Farily nice example of how slowing things down can change the whole feel of an effect - modified "Queens":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrd1AVkCbAA&feature=related

 

[Sinful07]

When he flares out the packets in that B4 variation, he turns his body so that you can see the packets that are being flared out. In this case, its not about how slowly or smoothly he does it, it is about the way he presents the move.

You honestly dont think that he performed it Slower than andrei? that's poor attention to detail. Grab a stopwatch and time the flare if you have to. Rewatch the B4 1 on 1 as well and time it.

When i said Slow, i didnt mean it'd take 30 seconds to perform one flourish.


Man, some people just dont understand.

 

[spades]

Good topic

I don't think it is neccesarily true that slow=smooth, not for everyone or in every situation.

The B4 in the linked video looked great, I think the speed and turn of the body really helped. However video 'style' can greatly affect how a cut looks. In a video with a 'faster pace', e.g. the virts reintroduction video the cut would better fit with the editing and music if done fast.

When flourishing I think it's about variety, my lethal isn't the fastet cut ever but I think that works. I do Alan Hagen's rotation cut as fast as I can (without dropping the cards ) which I think looks good, while Akira looks better slow and smooth.

So I guess what I'm getting at is experiment see how each flourish works best for you. Presentation. Variety is the spice of life

Interesting responses guys, liked visualartists idea too

 

[Sinful07]

The B4 in the linked video looked great, I think the speed and turn of the body really helped. However video 'style' can greatly affect how a cut looks. In a video with a 'faster pace', e.g. the virts reintroduction video the cut would better fit with the editing and music if done fast.

Just for the sake of argument- There is no 'Beat', 'Edits' or 'music' in real life. Why, do you only flourish for the camera?

Variety is cool too. its cool to combine some flourishes with others. For instance i combine my B4 with a stone ending. (stone- Daniel madison Dangerous DVD)

 

[Cardmagic12345]

That really don't like that video :\

Oh and please, try to avoid comments as to 'prefering slowness because its your style'. Frankly, we both know that you're doing it slow, because you cant do it fast.

That's just pure ignorance. There's lots of flourishes that don't even look good fast. Flourishing isn't even about being fast, its about whatever looks good.
Try looking at this video and see if it changes your mind
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dzIycYDL_A
and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dtn7BaYhCM&feature=channel_page
They both could go faster if he wanted to, but he chooses not too, and that's his style.

 

[Sinful07]

The thread is not about the video, it is the flourish that he executed.

To patronise you a tad bit more, purely for the sole reason that you accused me of being oh-so ignorant, Its because he executed the Flourish in a manner that appealed to me more 'Beautifully' (Synonyms: Pretty, Gorgeous) Rather than the Speedy version which i often see and perform myself.

Aside the fact that im quite offended of that comment, you have totally missed out on what i aimed to instigate in this thread.

That video you posted showed a Pandora variation which didnt appeal to me. Maybe it did to him, but the only thing that i liked was the L-cut in the beginning. The Pandora he executed was diagonal, instead of the traditional (And much preffered by yours truly) Vertical-Esque formation when Flaring/Displaying the cards.

We are talking about Flourishes, yes, but what i was pertaining to particularly in the first post as when i compared the flourish was about 'Set' flourishes that are taught (Mainstream flourishes) againts variations, and how little things such as movement of the body (which i will quite happily admit that forgot to mention) will greatly and invariably affect the way the flourish is seen.

To expand on that Further, Daniel Madison Often comments on his own movement when flourishing. If you notice, he moves around his body a lot in order to give the audience a better view of the flourish.

 

[Leon]

You honestly dont think that he performed it Slower than andrei? that's poor attention to detail. Grab a stopwatch and time the flare if you have to. Rewatch the B4 1 on 1 as well and time it.

When i said Slow, i didnt mean it'd take 30 seconds to perform one flourish.


Man, some people just dont understand.

I didn't say that he performed it slower than Andrei :O

I'm just saying that its not a matter of how fast or slow a move is performed in this case, its about the presentation.

Its YOU who don't get it ._.

 

[spades]

Just for the sake of argument- There is no 'Beat', 'Edits' or 'music' in real life. Why, do you only flourish for the camera?

I know, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that video presentation can 'aid' how a flourish looks, and it fits differently with different videos. Of course I don't 'flourish for the camera', don't make assumptions.
When I'm flourishing I do change speed, angles etc. Which is what I meant by variety. While I'll do Akira straight on, I'll turn and move with twisted rain. I was at a party/gathering one time, and ended up flourishing after a couple o' tricks. I tried to present them in a way that would display them best. But even when just flourishing for yourself I still think that presentation is important.

I'm just saying that its not a matter of how fast or slow a move is performed in this case, its about the presentation.

That's what I'm trying to get at

 

[dragon521]

Just because you perform something slow or fast doesn't make it good or bad, just perform however you want. Andrei's high speed combo's look just as good as Luka's and Brendan Conner's stuff and vice versa.

 

[TheatreHead]

smooth=slow.

it depends on the flourish.

some flourishes just look so much freaking better when done at top speed.

doing "what the hell happened to sybil" at top speed just looks absolutely amazing. i'd rather see brian tudor do it at his speed rather than some other flourisher slowing it down, making it look "smooth".

of course, this doesn't apply to everything. something like madonna wouldn't look as nice done as fast as possible.

 

[Cardmagic12345]

smooth=slow.

it depends on the flourish.

some flourishes just look so much freaking better when done at top speed.

doing "what the hell happened to sybil" at top speed just looks absolutely amazing. i'd rather see brian tudor do it at his speed rather than some other flourisher slowing it down, making it look "smooth".

of course, this doesn't apply to everything. something like madonna wouldn't look as nice done as fast as possible.

Thats just another BS phrase by Tudor. You can be smooth and fast, and you can be rough and slow.

The only thing that really matters is how you do it, somethings look nice fast, others look nice slow, some could look nice both ways.

Speed is nothing, slowness is nothing. Style is what matters.