A renaissance of cardistry

wZEnigma

Elite Member
Jun 17, 2009
1,511
153
NE Ohio.
ianchandlerwriting.com
Franky, I highly respect cardistry. I did not mean for it to be grim. Nowhere did I explicitly state that two-handed cuts are all that cardistry is. I am not ignorant; I see great originality in the art. However, it is still the exception. A wonderful exception, to be sure, but an exception nonetheless.
 

wZEnigma

Elite Member
Jun 17, 2009
1,511
153
NE Ohio.
ianchandlerwriting.com
I think a good starting point for this idea would be to set up a blog (or mabe a podcast if time and inclination permit) which featured in-depth interviews with people who might be able to signpost some future directions cardistry could take. People who understand what cardistry and non-magical manipulation is all about and are able to relate it to other performance arts.

Charlie Frye is a name which instantly springs to mind. As someone who has a foot planted in both the juggling and magic worlds, and with a long, varied and successful career, he'd be perfectly placed to talk about the nitty-gritty of what goes into getting a niche performance art in front of real people. From another perspective, someone like Michael Moschen would have great insights into turning a display of skill into a truly expressive performance.

Essentialy, I'm expanding on Steerpike's point. The key, as I see it, is to break cardistry out of the insular state it's in at the moment. And the way to do that is to seek insights from other areas of the performing arts. Jugglers get booked and everyone knows what juggling is. So what is it they do that cardists aren't currently doing? A blog which sought to answer this question, and to tie cardistry in with the centuries-old tradition of object manipulation to which it belongs, would probably be a good step forward for the scene.

I hadn't thought about the cooperation between the two. The blog is a nice idea, especially considering the juggling comparison. I like it.
 

yyyyyyy

Elite Member
Apr 7, 2012
537
12
I support this idea. There is alot of originality and stylistic diversity in Cardistry but it's not all golden. The thing that the Cardistry community is really missing is collaboration.

Decknique has been gone for years and there hasn't been another popular place of collaboration since then.
To a decent chunk of cardists, being as smooth or original as possible isn't as big of a priority anymore. It's all about putting flourishes on the Wire, or getting that big DVD project with one of the major magic companies. Cardists lie to themselves and other people refuse to criticize constructively.

Are these people representative of the entire community? No, definitely not. There are cardists that genuinely care about the subtleties of performing and the keys to making beautiful material. But the "good" and "bad" cardists are not collaborating, so the community isn't growing as much as it could.

So yes, I think that a place of collaboration might be beneficial for Cardistry.
 

wZEnigma

Elite Member
Jun 17, 2009
1,511
153
NE Ohio.
ianchandlerwriting.com
I support this idea. There is alot of originality and stylistic diversity in Cardistry but it's not all golden. The thing that the Cardistry community is really missing is collaboration.

Decknique has been gone for years and there hasn't been another popular place of collaboration since then.
To a decent chunk of cardists, being as smooth or original as possible isn't as big of a priority anymore. It's all about putting flourishes on the Wire, or getting that big DVD project with one of the major magic companies. Cardists lie to themselves and other people refuse to criticize constructively.

Are these people representative of the entire community? No, definitely not. There are cardists that genuinely care about the subtleties of performing and the keys to making beautiful material. But the "good" and "bad" cardists are not collaborating, so the community isn't growing as much as it could.

So yes, I think that a place of collaboration might be beneficial for Cardistry.

I agree completely. Growth requires community, and without a meeting place, it struggles. The fact that cardistry is a niche art doesn't help, either. It's not as widespread as magic, so cardists are not that common. There seem to be hubs, but I don't know anyone else personally who does cardistry.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
42
London
I agree completely. Growth requires community, and without a meeting place, it struggles. The fact that cardistry is a niche art doesn't help, either. It's not as widespread as magic, so cardists are not that common. There seem to be hubs, but I don't know anyone else personally who does cardistry.

I think perhaps "growth" isn't what cardistry needs. Maybe what it needs is focus. What's the point of more and more people doing more and more of the same? Whether there are a thousand or ten million people making cardistry YouTube videos doesn't really make much difference to the development of the art. Neither does the release of more DVDs or downloads teaching more moves. What would make a difference is a non-cardist audience.

The video that would really make a difference to the scene is a step-by-step instructional resource following a cardist's process of developing an act, marketing that act to a show booker (maybe a variety show, a circus skills show or a juggling festival), then performing the show and getting paid for it. Cardistry doesn't need more moves or amateur practitioners to be taken seriously, it needs some professional performers.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Decknique has been gone for years and there hasn't been another popular place of collaboration since then.

Given how political it was, I'd say it fell victim to itself.

To a decent chunk of cardists, being as smooth or original as possible isn't as big of a priority anymore. It's all about putting flourishes on the Wire, or getting that big DVD project with one of the major magic companies. Cardists lie to themselves and other people refuse to criticize constructively.

And here we come across one of the major problems. It's been commercialized (sort of) so now everyone wants the get-rich/famous-quick route of publishing a hit DVD or download. You remember some of the guys posting about their videos not getting onto the Wire? Holy crap! A finer bunch of whiny, self-entitled douchebags I have not seen since I peeked into the PUA community after a three-year hiatus. I digress.

Here's how I look at the problem: think of it in terms of evolution. A handful of guys have created these hit DVDs or been hand doubles in a movie or whatever. That was a niche that previously did not exist and they evolved into it. But now, everyone is trying to evolve into it too. Oblivious to the fact that niche has already been virtually monopolized by a handful of guys. They got there first and locked out most of the competition. There's very little room left in that niche.

So if that's the problem, then the solution would be to do what seems counterintuitive. Rather than doing what those before you did, expand your horizons, try new things and evolve into a niche that you create for yourself. No easy feat, but very attainable. Assuming of course that one is willing to do the work.

Robert Greene talks about this in "Mastery." Some of the greatest achievers in history got to where they were by creating a field that previously didn't exist and then dominating it. It is one of several different strategies you can take and by no means the only path to success. However, I've been training myself to think in counterintuitive ways lately, so this is the strategy that I tend to gravitate toward.
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
Since I know me and steer get flack for always being downers, i thought I would make it a back to back positive post. ONe from each of us.

There are two downloadable lectures. One from Mark Mason and one from Oz Pearlman, The last half hour or so of the Mark Mason lecture talks about how to market your effects. The Oz Pearlman lecture is about corporate magic. It explaina about where to perform, how to price your performances, and how to hook people in so that they ask for your business card. Speaking of business cards. Maybe work on some cardistry with those.

The last thing you need to do is create a brand. Give them a reason to want your service. How you ad value to their event.
 
Sep 1, 2007
3,786
15
Since I know me and steer get flack for always being downers,

At least until they watch Grave of the Fireflies. Then they'll know what a downer is.

The last thing you need to do is create a brand. Give them a reason to want your service. How you ad value to their event.

That right there is the mistake a lot of new guys make. Value is relative and you have to learn how to talk to people and offer them a value that they can get their heads around. It's not always easy. A guy in my mastermind has known me for years but he still can't get his head around the fact that I'm a mentalist now, not a street magician. He's been doing favors for an 18-year-old newcomer, but nothing for me lately. While it kind of sucks to be given the cold shoulder after almost 10 years of knowing the guy, I'm not going to waste my time trying to get his idea of value to align with mine. He doesn't want the implicit experience I offer, he's impressed with overt displays of skill. If anything, flourishers should target dudes like him.
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
That is why I suggested the Oz Pearlman lecture. There is almost no magic in the lecture. It is all about brand management and how to set the hook on a client in the corporate world. I know some people in this sub forum do not want to listen to magicians, even though who get upwards of five grand for a weekend of work at a trade show, but there is something to be learned from those type of lectures. Another great guy to look up is Charles Green III. He had a few write up in the trade papers back in the mid to late 90's and he is still active in the trade show and corporate world.

Side note... I know the my last post should have been Steer and I but I'm talking to a magician who runs his own theater. He's letting me pick his brain and was firing off a quick post over here in between emails.
 
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