Criss Angel An Amazing "Magician"?

[Keeper]

There isn't much more to be said here. But I'd like to give my input nonetheless. A couple of events lured me into the world of magic. It started with a David Blaine special. I've always been intriqued by magic, but rarely an act. DB did some pretty cool card tricks that I thought were impressive. Later that year, while deployed overseas, one of my officers went around doing tricks for guys to keep up our morale. I tried to mimick some of his tricks and after showing him what I knew, he showed me a few moves. Said if I practiced them till I got them down and came up with an application for them, he'd show me more. After returning to CONUS, I saw Chris Angel's Mindfreak series and was completely hooked.

Chris's abilities, along with David and the officer, got me excited about magic. Enough so that I started looking into how to learn this craft. I respect creativity, dexterity, guile, and performance involved in pulling off tricks. For that, I give Chris credit. He certainly wowed me and made me want more.

I dislike his ego though. His endless plugs and self promotion are more than annoying. Hearing that he uses stooges and video editing is incredibly disappointing. Especially the editing part. Yes - the performance is entertaining, but using a computer to make the effect nullifies the performance in my view. It's no longer a magic act, it's a scam - a hoax. This crosses the line from illusionist/magician to specail effects artist.

I don't know the validity of the video editing claim, as this thread is the first place I've read where people truely say it to be true. I don't know what illusions or how often (how many tricks) this has been applied. Did he touch of a video, or complete the illusion with software? I don't know. But I still like Chris's tricks and the plausable will continue to inspire me to stick with this art.

 

[Liam Carrie]

i dont consider him a magician, for the camera tricks, Confederates, And his Ego.

 

[Steerpike]

i dont consider him a magician, for the camera tricks, Confederates, And his Ego.

He does use camera tricks, but he's also an accomplished stage illusionist. There's no denying that. Even Morgan Strebler said he issued his challenge to Criss to get him to own up to his own potential.

The use of stooges is as old as magic itself. They've been used by Slydini, Copperfield, Penn & Teller, Rick Maue, Sean Fields... the list goes on. If you honestly think using stooges categorically disqualifies someone as a magician, you're an misinformed. No two ways about it.

As for the ego, if being a narcissist disqualifies someone from being an artist (or in this case a magician) then we have maybe only a couple dozen real artists the world over.

Keep talking people, you're just proving me right when I talk crap on magicians.

 

[Markm51]

You seem like an argumentive person. I bet if the majority of posts in this forum were in support of Criss Angel, you'd find a way trash him.
You also happened to grossly misunderstand my statements which is why I tried to give him respect for what he is from the start. This, however, doesn't change the fact that approaching "strangers" in a lobby and teleporting them 60 ft away in a split second is not good magic. There is nothing wrong with using stooges, camera editing, or exteme prep work, however, when the effects on his show almost always exhibits one of these thing, it becomes a mockery of magic. And no he is not discrace. I just happen to disagree with what he does.
The title of this thread was "Criss Angel an amazing "magician"? My opinion is No and there is nothing you can say to change that opinion. Your edgy arguments are fun to read though so keep em coming.

 

[Steerpike]

You seem like an argumentive person.

Somebody around here has to be. They call it devil's advocate for a reason.

I bet if the majority of posts in this forum were in support of Criss Angel, you'd find a way trash him.

Don't feed me that tired old cliche. Everybody who can rub two braincells together knows what a bogus strawman that is.

This, however, doesn't change the fact that approaching "strangers" in a lobby and teleporting them 60 ft away in a split second is not good magic.

His show has been a huge disappointment, but his early work was spectacular.

My opinion is No and there is nothing you can say to change that opinion.

I'm just pointing out to most of these rabble that Criss did in fact do stuff before Mindfreak. And it was actually pretty good.

 

[urban entropy]

I count you among the minority that have something to say. Mostly because you're a realist.

I stand by my stance that magicians in general are petty crybabies and elitists with ego problems in some form or another. They rallying hatred for Criss Angel is just another example. Even when he does something right like calling out Jim Callahan on Phenomenon, people still find a way to complain about it.

Coming from you that means a lot, mainly because based on your posts I can tell that I would greatly enjoy conversation with you. Also, I can tell that I would share very similar tastes in many things with you (based on what I've read anyway.) HP Lovecraft is truly one of the greats.

As for Criss I have always held that he deserves great respect - otherwise he wouldn't be where he is. His early work is incredible and I agree with you on that point for sure. The only complaint I held fast on with Phenomenon was that the show itself (nothing to do with Angel) was bad - but I hold the Producers and executive producers ultimately responsible for that show.

What could be perceived as Criss' character on his show and the incredible ego he has (I just feel it's undeniable that Criss has one on the show and in the public eye) is becoming more of a hindrance to his work / show then it is worth. It takes away from the ultimate goal of what I am sure he is trying to create and that is too bad.

However it is undeniable that Criss deserves respect; and no matter - It's not like he is going anyway either. His show is scheduled for at least two more seasons at this point.

As for Devil's Advocate - I hope you keep it up Steerpike - makes for a much more interesting forum to say the least! And we all know how truly logical the devil's arguments can be! (Not a sarcastic statement)

Rd

 

[Markm51]

I also have great respect for Angel's earlier work. I actually encouraged my non magician friends to watch the first season of mindfreak. Once the second season came around I found him to be doing so many ridiculous stunts that as a magician, I couldn't even be entertained by it. By "magicians's magician" I simply meant that he is a pop artist of the magic community. If you were a legimate musical arist who wrote and performed there own songs and you felt one of your fellow musicians had songs wrote for him and faked live performances, then you will look down on him. The same as an admired kong fu actor who you find out doesn't perform his own stunts.
I can't realistically say if I were Criss Angel I wouldn't be doing that same thing, but I would love to think that I wouldn't.

 

[Steerpike]

HP Lovecraft is truly one of the greats.

For that alone I'll buy you a beer.

The only complaint I held fast on with Phenomenon was that the show itself (nothing to do with Angel) was bad - but I hold the Producers and executive producers ultimately responsible for that show.

I won't debate that. I watch very little TV anymore because it's so banal. I only ever watch the occasional Daily Show, Colbert Report, Metalocalypse (currently the best show on TV), and a couple of shows on CourtTV (although the writers feeding lines to the author-hosts on Murder by the Book need to stop watching Billy Wilder movies).

To be honest, I lost faith in TV after Mystery Science Theater was taken off the air followed by Farscape, but I'm getting off on a tangent.

Phenomenon was American Idol for magicians, plain and simple. Packed with C and D-list celebrities (if you're "celebrity audience" does not even include Bruce Campbell, it is not celebrity anything) and taking votes via text messaging just made it clear that it was just a shallow grab for ratings.

By "magicians's magician" I simply meant that he is a pop artist of the magic community.

Pop is not a dirty word, nor should it be. Just thought I'd put that out there.

If you were a legimate musical arist who wrote and performed there own songs and you felt one of your fellow musicians had songs wrote for him and faked live performances, then you will look down on him.

Elvis Presley never wrote his own songs. And he was still The King.

The phenomenon of frowning on third-party songwriters is a relatively recent one, actually. The Delta blues is one of the most musically incestuous genres of all time once you think about it.

The same as an admired kong fu actor who you find out doesn't perform his own stunts.

Some action stars are simply too valuable to the studio to allow them to do all of their own stunts. Just the way it goes.

 

[urban entropy]

For that alone I'll buy you a beer.

Thank you. Much appreciated.

I won't debate that. I watch very little TV anymore because it's so banal. I only ever watch the occasional Daily Show, Colbert Report, Metalocalypse (currently the best show on TV), and a couple of shows on CourtTV (although the writers feeding lines to the author-hosts on Murder by the Book need to stop watching Billy Wilder movies).

Once again - agreed. Technically speaking the only real time I have the tv on is when I am watching a movie and to be honest that is my true weakness. I love movies and always will.

Phenomenon was American Idol for magicians, plain and simple. Packed with C and D-list celebrities (if you're "celebrity audience" does not even include Bruce Campbell, it is not celebrity anything)

Absolutely spot on. Bruce Campbell, I have to truly admit - the only real enjoyable and entertaining part of Spiderman 3.

Phenomenon was American Idol for magicians, plain and simple. Packed with C and D-list celebrities (if you're "celebrity audience" does not even include Bruce Campbell, it is not celebrity anything)

Absolutely. Unfortunately this is the trend with television and one of the many reasons it is so banal. I can't see it ever being rescued either. I do throw respect to JJ.Abrams though. The man is creative, and I don't think we have seen his best ideas come to fruition yet.

Some action stars are simply too valuable to the studio to allow them to do all of their own stunts. Just the way it goes.

Very true. Actor's have to fight tooth and nail a lot of the times in order to be aloud to do a stunt; and even then sometimes their 'celebrity muscle' doesn't get them anywhere.

So ........about that beer.......

 

[Cardmagic12345]

Of course he's not amazing.


He should actually practice for once,stop doing those F'n camera tricks, Fake Tricks that involve an actor,


And actually perform for REAL spectators


and Criss whats with that phanomanon crap.

You were supposed tobe a judge not a heckler.



Your a disgrace to magic thats the end of it.






imo

 

[Liam Carrie]

i heard he uses holdout devices if any of you have heard of them.

 

[Liam Carrie]

As for Devil's Advocate - I hope you keep it up Steerpike - makes for a much more interesting forum to say the least! And we all know how truly logical the devil's arguments can be! (Not a sarcastic statement)

Rd

I must admit i also start many arguments but i only want to share my opinions with the world.

 

[BlueBackedBikes]

Steerpike, if I ever start a debate team, you're first on my list

 

[Steerpike]

and Criss whats with that phanomanon crap.

You were supposed tobe a judge not a heckler.

Oh please. You don't even know what a heckler is so don't feed me a line like that.

More proof that magicians in general are thin-skinned and defensive. Callahan's reaction on Phenomenon was embarassing, but I'm glad none of you people were put in the same place because you'd be even worse.

Your a disgrace to magic thats the end of it.

Kids like you lot are. Small wonder the magic community is so far behind the times.

It truly astounds me. You have Uri Geller douchebagging out of control all over the show, and what do you choose to whine about? Criss Angel challenging a guy pulling a mediumistic stunt and trying to have it both ways. Jesus cross-dressing Christ on a bike...

What this all boils down to is that most of you are incapable of remaining secure in your own abilities and have to demonize someone to create a sense of superiority.

Don't get me wrong, I'm barely what you'd call of average intelligence yet I think most of you are a bunch of loud-mouthed rabble and I read celebrity gossip now and again so that I can say, "I may not be rich, but at least I'm not making routine trips to Betty Ford." But it's getting to the point where you lot are starting to sound like Colonel Klink cursing Hogan.

 

[KatieKenner]

I think Criss Angel should go on Dancing with The Stars

KE

 

[Apostle O]

My take on this:

Chriss Angel takes the stage performance world to the street. His illusions are amazing, and his skill is incredible.

Then we have the other street rival that everyone has just as many opinions about here: David Blaine.

I personally think that David Blaine is the better at crowd control and entertainment. Blaine's tricks are things that we all know (or at least can learn with a little money out of pocket online) and yet he gets huge reactions. The laymen have very little to guess at in regards to his methods, not because he is a better magician, but because they aren't thinking about that. They are more focused on the show than the secret.

So, when the question arises, "Who is better, Blaine or Angel?" I respond "At what?"

(Oh, on a side note, this is my first post on the forums here. I hope that I can become a valued part of the community with time.)

-Apostle O

 

[ZeroPhun31]

OIn my eyes, Criss doesn't use stooges, he's just so damn good at what he does he leads you to believe he uses stooges which is an illusion in itself.
Anthony Bass

Then your eyes are blind if you dont realize he's using stooges for i'd say 80% of the garbage he tries to pull off. You let me know when YOU can do Gutbuster with a truely random passer-by.

Or levitate from building to building with 'random' people holding a camera watching you, negating the fact that the sun angle changes with each camera angle change (edit)

Or when you openly see him place a card on top of a rack of billiard balls, only when the camera angle 'instantly' changes the card is gone and no one has moved.

Nothing Angel does has ever impressed it, it's made me laugh more then anything.

Thumbs up to the camera editing software and stooge crew comment.

 

[Brewery Rabbit]

I think Criss Angel should go on Dancing with The Stars

KE

Omg that would be epic!

I want to see david blaine.. Or penn and teller on dancing with the stars =P

~Jordan

 

[Corey]

Angel? Seriously guys...

I have seen so many threads on this guy! Consistantly, people seem to wonder "how he does it"... or "is he a fake?"... or the classic, "I hate him"
Well I got news for you guys... Some people are going to have an opinion, that you might not like... Deal with it!
If he wants to use camera tricks... LET HIM! He seems to have gotten somewhere with them. Some people may have an opinion of what is "acceptional". If you don't like something he does, there are two options you may have:
1. Leave it be, it's not you'r buisiness...(Laymen)
2. Don't put it into you'r act!(Magicians)
Now for another point, he in fact does use stooges, some may argue, but he does. Remember the episode where he told one girl she couldn't be used because she was "too short", then chose another, and pulled her "in half"...
Google it... she was two women from the circuis that perform an act together. One a contortionist, and the other a lady who lost both her legs in a car accident...

So please, if you don't like him, leave him be... You are ALL acting like enraged high-school teen-agers in a debate on who should be head of the school council. Except that school council is more important than if someone is gaff or not gaff. Let it be!!!

 

[KatieKenner]

No matter how much you hate him, despise him or even like him. This dude is on TV A LOT!

Sure, we all can do the tricks he does, he uses camera effects and he is kind of a jerk. But HE is on TV once a week. How many of us can really say that? None of us.

I just wish he would keep his mouth shut and do magic tricks. He is a magician, and no offense, I am a magician too... but the real world doesn't care if he has an opinion and he has proven to be the king of contradiction.

Thats just my thought on Criss Angel... And I still think he should be on Dancing With the Stars... Shoot, I would even volunteer to be his professional partner. But, I digress...


Katie Egleston