Okay, there's been silence on my original question regarding whether the "restored" card can be handed out immediately to the spectator (without going back to the deck). I have to conclude that the answer is probably not. I hope that we're not expected to then tear up the card at the end. There are plenty of piece-by-piece T&R card effects where you can hand out the card immediately. So, I'll be open-minded, and looking forward to seeing what advantages this effect contributes to the cannon...
FOURFIT :: Restoration #1
- Thread starter heatedjeans
- Start date
To quote what Alex posted on the cafe in regards to the handling...
"In the DVD Reuben teaches how to hand out the card at the end, the switch happens during the last restoration. This means - you don't need to go back to the deck and switch the card. Also, keep in mind...in any other tnr that "ends clean" you are still stealing something off in the end. The same goes with Fourfit - you can end completely clean after restoring the card and hand it out right away.
I really hope this helps man, I don't want you to get something you won't use or get any use of of it...one thing I can tell you is that there is so much more on this DVD than just the routine. One handed restorations, GREAT subtleties on making this look exactly as if it were restoring, variations of each restoration, a way to do everything face up, how to show both sides throughout every phase, plus a super clean tearing sequence that sets you up for the routine!
Ok, lol sorry for rambling, I just really believe this is a winner ...I have hated tnr effects ever since trying to read through drawing room deceptions when I was younger haha - I have performed Fourfit quite a few times now...that says a lot if you know me
Alex^"
"In the DVD Reuben teaches how to hand out the card at the end, the switch happens during the last restoration. This means - you don't need to go back to the deck and switch the card. Also, keep in mind...in any other tnr that "ends clean" you are still stealing something off in the end. The same goes with Fourfit - you can end completely clean after restoring the card and hand it out right away.
I really hope this helps man, I don't want you to get something you won't use or get any use of of it...one thing I can tell you is that there is so much more on this DVD than just the routine. One handed restorations, GREAT subtleties on making this look exactly as if it were restoring, variations of each restoration, a way to do everything face up, how to show both sides throughout every phase, plus a super clean tearing sequence that sets you up for the routine!
Ok, lol sorry for rambling, I just really believe this is a winner ...I have hated tnr effects ever since trying to read through drawing room deceptions when I was younger haha - I have performed Fourfit quite a few times now...that says a lot if you know me
Alex^"
I HATE when they say that: because when it turns out (more likely then not) that I don't have what is required, I fall into this weird slump where I don't feel like I'm a real magician... :/
Hi Nathanael,
To be exact, all you need is a deck of cards. If you have a deck of cards and the FourFit video, you're good to go.
Really? Awesome. To be specific, I'm talking about adds that say: every good magician has it already! ... then it turns out to be a stripper deck, and I'm like: whaaaaa? I never use those; I don't want to buy one; I think I wasted my money. :/
But if it's really just a deck of cards; I'm totally going to buy this.
the version you see on the video needs a "gimmick gaff card" can't be signed and hand out at the end
yeah, it was kind of dissappointing when i bought it. All the stuff they advertise: can be handed out, can be signed, can show front and back at the same time. Was very dissappointed to see that its nearly impossible to do all of that. I would recomend owning impromtorn and ref4m. In my opinion this was over advertised and it wasn't quite what they said it was going to be.
Hey everyone, just want to jump in here. I can see some of you are disappointed with FourFeit. Today, Theory11 released an effect of mine on The Wire called Restored. Which I think some of you will be pleased with, due to the strong differences with it between FourFeit. Someone asked me in another thread what the differences between Restored and FourFeit are, here's my reply
Theory11 :: Restored // Lloyd Barnes
Theory11 :: Restored // Lloyd Barnes
Great question!
Well, where to start. The method are WORLDS apart. The angles on this are much better than FourFeit, especially the 1st restoation. With Restored, the card can be examined and handed out after the second restoration and final restoration. You cannot hand the card out at any point during the routine with FourFeit. With FourFeit, you have to switch the card after the final restoration, which means going back to the deck like in TnR by Mathieu Bich. With Restored, you hand the card out instantly.
I don't own FourFeit but I own an effect, previously published by Jamie Dawes called Faultless which is the same basic method, but people on the forums are saying you have to have a gimmicked card to do some of the things with FourFeit. There are NO gimmicks needed with Restored.
Also, with Restored, it was reviewed and researched for nearly 8 days by the guys here at Theory11 to ensure that it was correctly credited and totally original.
Lastly, the final card is fully restored with Restored. Without exposing FourFeit, when the final piece is restored on the card, it cannot be handed out.
I'm not giving FourFeit a bashing, just pointing out the Pros and Cons between both.
Hope this helps
Lloyd
Thank you, means a lot mateLloyd Barnes , i love your tnr . It looks better than Fourfit , cheaper too
Hope you enjoy performing it as much as I have.Lloyd
I was forwarded this thread by a friend of mine that said I should check it out since this new tnr came out and just thought i should point something out...
Lloyd, I'm sure your tnr is very nice and all that...but I don't feel its fair to criticize Fourfit without actually owning it...that sorta discredits your whole post, don't you think? How can you talk about the differences when you don't even own the effect? Doesn't make much sense...
Fourfit is the most visual TNR to date (according to just about everyone who has purchased it)...all the other tnr effects look the same - I'm sorry, including Lloyd's. With Fourfit, there are multiple handling of EACH phase including one handed restorations, angle proof restorations, etc.
You CAN give out the card without going back to the deck 100%...so again, don't know where you got your statement from that you cant...
as far as the price is concerned...like most things...you get what you pay for
In any case, I wish Lloyd all the best with his magic...it takes talent to come up with a TNR and I respect anyone that has something cool to bring to the table
Alex^
Lloyd, I'm sure your tnr is very nice and all that...but I don't feel its fair to criticize Fourfit without actually owning it...that sorta discredits your whole post, don't you think? How can you talk about the differences when you don't even own the effect? Doesn't make much sense...
Fourfit is the most visual TNR to date (according to just about everyone who has purchased it)...all the other tnr effects look the same - I'm sorry, including Lloyd's. With Fourfit, there are multiple handling of EACH phase including one handed restorations, angle proof restorations, etc.
You CAN give out the card without going back to the deck 100%...so again, don't know where you got your statement from that you cant...
as far as the price is concerned...like most things...you get what you pay for
In any case, I wish Lloyd all the best with his magic...it takes talent to come up with a TNR and I respect anyone that has something cool to bring to the table
Alex^
Hey guys,
So here are just my thoughts on Fourfit and Restored by lloyd. Restored by lloyd angles are good, however there isn't that visual aspects and cleanliness to it that Fourfit has. Fourfit is an extremely well thought out routine, and the teaching is second to none. Shot in 1080p, Reueben teaches his routine side by side with a mirror, which in my opinion is an extremely clever way to teach such a complex routine. That said, lets move on to Restored by lloyd. First off, the quality isnt there. The tutorial isnt shot in True HD and unlike FourFit, which is shot with a canon 5d mark ii. That said, lets move on to the method. Without revealing too much, it's a great idea and concept, because the angles are good. But the downside is that the trick just isn't magical in any way shape or form. Heck, Lloyd flashes about 3 times in his performance video. Also, his tear sequence is really awkward, whereas Reubens is flawless. I showed this to my roommate and he asked me why lloyd was so "awkward" when performing this. Now for practicality, FourFit is essentially gimmickless in my opinion. It takes literally 2 seconds to set the trick up, and you're set and ready to go. I compared these two effects by showing the trailers of both FourFit and Restored to my roomate and asked him which one he liked. He preferred fourfit because of its simplicity and cleanliness. In terms of pricing, the reason why it is 10 dollars extra is because Reuben goes over an hour teaching numerous variations(the variations that reuben teaches allows you to perform in the same angle conditions that "restored" allows."), going over different types of restorations which will fit your needs, and like i said before, the teaching is second to none. Fourfit is a very well thought out TnR and in my opinion one of the best because of its practicality and the cleanliness of it. Though both fourfit and Restored can be handed out for examination, As magicians, we want to perform what looks like magic, and in my opinion, Fourfit accomplishes that.
Shin Lim
So here are just my thoughts on Fourfit and Restored by lloyd. Restored by lloyd angles are good, however there isn't that visual aspects and cleanliness to it that Fourfit has. Fourfit is an extremely well thought out routine, and the teaching is second to none. Shot in 1080p, Reueben teaches his routine side by side with a mirror, which in my opinion is an extremely clever way to teach such a complex routine. That said, lets move on to Restored by lloyd. First off, the quality isnt there. The tutorial isnt shot in True HD and unlike FourFit, which is shot with a canon 5d mark ii. That said, lets move on to the method. Without revealing too much, it's a great idea and concept, because the angles are good. But the downside is that the trick just isn't magical in any way shape or form. Heck, Lloyd flashes about 3 times in his performance video. Also, his tear sequence is really awkward, whereas Reubens is flawless. I showed this to my roommate and he asked me why lloyd was so "awkward" when performing this. Now for practicality, FourFit is essentially gimmickless in my opinion. It takes literally 2 seconds to set the trick up, and you're set and ready to go. I compared these two effects by showing the trailers of both FourFit and Restored to my roomate and asked him which one he liked. He preferred fourfit because of its simplicity and cleanliness. In terms of pricing, the reason why it is 10 dollars extra is because Reuben goes over an hour teaching numerous variations(the variations that reuben teaches allows you to perform in the same angle conditions that "restored" allows."), going over different types of restorations which will fit your needs, and like i said before, the teaching is second to none. Fourfit is a very well thought out TnR and in my opinion one of the best because of its practicality and the cleanliness of it. Though both fourfit and Restored can be handed out for examination, As magicians, we want to perform what looks like magic, and in my opinion, Fourfit accomplishes that.
Shin Lim
Lloyd Barnes , i love your tnr . It looks better than Fourfit , cheaper too
What two trailers did you watch? Just no. FourFit looks amazing. I don't own it, nor do I trust any review I see anymore. People hate everything that releases nowadays.
I don't care about the HD, but i do care when the advertising says "can be sign and and hand out" but you can't with Fourfeit
so it's a lie
so it's a lie
First of all, like I've all ready stated, I haven't been criticizing Ruebens FourFit. I've only been pointing out the Pro's and Con's between mine and his. I have a strict criteria when it comes to TnRs and I was sure to make mine adhere to all of these rules. I was going to take the plunge and buy FourFit out of my next pay (I collect TnRs I'm a bit of a nut for them) but a friend of mine has it and highlighted some of my main concerns for me.
Luckily, Restored looks nothing like any other TnR out there. Each piece happens edge by edge. With everything being shown front and back before and after every restoration. And finally, the final piece happens edgy by edge. Exactly how a Torn and Restored card should look. It's handed out immediately. It can even be handed out in the middle of the routine!
The second point I want to make is. Super-True-Crystal-HyperVision-High-Deffinition quality is not important. Period. If you can learn the full routine from the video then that's all you need. I shot Reformed on a high definition camera, the quality is perfect to learn from. So any points regarding picture quality, when the you can learn from the video, are obsolete.
The ripping routine in FourFeit is taken Paul Harris' Ultimate Rip Off. That's been many people favorite TnR for years and I've never heard anyone giving him grief for the ripping sequence?
I'm not sure what you mean by saying one is more visual than the other, it doesn't make sense, sorry. In both the pieces are touched together and the card is restored. Apart from the illogical last piece in FourFeit. If you could really do magic, it would happen edge by edge. Magicians have been trying to work it out for years and I've had an overwhelming response from some well respected names for doing a TnR that looks like a TnR.
Also, I put a full performance trailer up of Restored, so, yes there might have been a small flash. But, I'm not afraid of that and I didn't just want to make a trailer of only the most visual elements of the routine. I wanted the full thing to show people how the routine would look in real life and to show them exactly what they were buying. Nothing wrong with FourFits trailer but you can't see the full routine begging to end, especially how he get in to position for the last piece. Anyone is gonna love FourFits trailer to mine, it's good quality and to a laymen, it's not boring like mine is. All the get readys and awkward moments have been edited out. Being a well respected magician Shim, I thought you would have realized this?
Lastly, Restored is my most memorable effect for my audience. It's the one effect that gets requested time after time. It looks exactly how Torn and Restored should be done. It's just magical in their eyes.
FourFit looks sick in the trailer! There's no denying it. All this has come from, is someone asking me the difference between the two effects, so I listed the pros and cons to both. I'm sure there's good points that FourFit has above mine that I haven't realized yet. If someone asks me something about FourFit that makes mine look bad, I will honestly tell them. FourFit is gonna sell really well and I can see why. I wish Rueben, Alex and everyone at The Blue Crown the best with this. I'm sorry if this has turned in to a hate thread, it was never my intention. Let's get the show back on the road and continue talking about FourFit
Luckily, Restored looks nothing like any other TnR out there. Each piece happens edge by edge. With everything being shown front and back before and after every restoration. And finally, the final piece happens edgy by edge. Exactly how a Torn and Restored card should look. It's handed out immediately. It can even be handed out in the middle of the routine!
The second point I want to make is. Super-True-Crystal-HyperVision-High-Deffinition quality is not important. Period. If you can learn the full routine from the video then that's all you need. I shot Reformed on a high definition camera, the quality is perfect to learn from. So any points regarding picture quality, when the you can learn from the video, are obsolete.
The ripping routine in FourFeit is taken Paul Harris' Ultimate Rip Off. That's been many people favorite TnR for years and I've never heard anyone giving him grief for the ripping sequence?
I'm not sure what you mean by saying one is more visual than the other, it doesn't make sense, sorry. In both the pieces are touched together and the card is restored. Apart from the illogical last piece in FourFeit. If you could really do magic, it would happen edge by edge. Magicians have been trying to work it out for years and I've had an overwhelming response from some well respected names for doing a TnR that looks like a TnR.
Also, I put a full performance trailer up of Restored, so, yes there might have been a small flash. But, I'm not afraid of that and I didn't just want to make a trailer of only the most visual elements of the routine. I wanted the full thing to show people how the routine would look in real life and to show them exactly what they were buying. Nothing wrong with FourFits trailer but you can't see the full routine begging to end, especially how he get in to position for the last piece. Anyone is gonna love FourFits trailer to mine, it's good quality and to a laymen, it's not boring like mine is. All the get readys and awkward moments have been edited out. Being a well respected magician Shim, I thought you would have realized this?
Lastly, Restored is my most memorable effect for my audience. It's the one effect that gets requested time after time. It looks exactly how Torn and Restored should be done. It's just magical in their eyes.
FourFit looks sick in the trailer! There's no denying it. All this has come from, is someone asking me the difference between the two effects, so I listed the pros and cons to both. I'm sure there's good points that FourFit has above mine that I haven't realized yet. If someone asks me something about FourFit that makes mine look bad, I will honestly tell them. FourFit is gonna sell really well and I can see why. I wish Rueben, Alex and everyone at The Blue Crown the best with this. I'm sorry if this has turned in to a hate thread, it was never my intention. Let's get the show back on the road and continue talking about FourFit
I know Lloyd very well so i'm not going to promote his product.
But I came up with fourfit (the method in the trailer with a different final restoration) about a year back, and after trying to work it at gigs and casual social events I realised that it wasn't as practical as say .. ReinCardnation .. or torn.
So decided to not bother using it again.
A few months ago David Forrest put star on the market and I thought that was enough said on this particular method.
For exposure sake it's not EXACTLY the same, but if you know Star you'll understand the concept behind Fourfit.
Blue crown have amazingly produced products, but im telling you for a fact that they haven't done their research on this particular method, or on how it plays in a real world situation.
.. and just to Clarify .. i'm not telling you this so you go and buy Lloyd's, that is your decision... but it's best to let you all know about the practicality of this product and the deceiving marketing.
Good luck to both creators,
-G