Put the cards down...

[Luis Vega]

just as you said with dan, thats what i love about kevin parker, i think he maturation and quality of his effect since his first release has gotten better and he keeps doing it...the kool thing about kevin is that when you learn the secrets, the first thing that comes to a person mind is "damn thats so simple, i could've come up with that"...its simple but very effective...kevin parker is one of my favorites....he doesn't uses these high price gimmicks, he uses normal stuff, everyday stuff, and does his thang...

i might be exaggerating but if i'll go on record for saying this:

If you gave kevin parker a rock, he'd build an entire castle......

well he is indeed one of the most creative minds now...I know a lot of people says that his stuff is garbage..but if you could look at his new stuff you will be amazed, personally "From Nothing" is one of my most common used effects with fruit

..besides everyone here know who he is...and the people that bash him are forgotten very quickly

 

[Cedric Taylor]

well he is indeed one of the most creative minds now...I know a lot of people says that his stuff is garbage..but if you could look at his new stuff you will be amazed, personally "From Nothing" is one of my most common used effects with fruit

..besides everyone here know who he is...and the people that bash him are forgotten very quickly

i love the effect where he vanishes the ring...it has no cover and vanishes like real magic....i'm not sure if its out yet but i am going to get that one...

also crooked, wow, one of the best metal bending effects to come along.....

thats who i want to be like, kevin parker....

 

[visualartist]

Well what do you do with card magic to make it not suck?

No apologies, card tricks are banal. They've been done so many times that at this point it's digging up the horse's grave to continue beating what's left of its bleached bones. This can be at least partly attributed to the fact that most magicians have the personality of a stick.

So if you specialize in cards, what reason does an audience have to care?

quoted for truth,and an important question.

 

[scarecrow1]

quoted for truth,and an important question.

I think magic (at least for me, and it's something I've started to work on) should be more than just cards and coins. To me, cards and coins seem like "sleight of hand" and "trickery". Something that is done with random objects, and not forced... that's what magic is.

What I mean by not forced is instead of "Hey, can I show you a card trick!" It should be brought up in conversation. Like an example I've used before, Redline by Dan Hauss. Instead of "Can I borrow someones chapstick?" it should be someone's using their chapstick and then "Hey, could I borrow that for a sec?" It looks so much more like true magic if it just seems unplanned and on the fly. Not something you've planned and practiced for weeks.

Hope that was clear

 

[KeoSilver]

This is my post to steerpikes question recently quoted:

Your audience shouldn't care, if they are starting to care that you are only using cards then the magi is not giving their participants enough. By that I mean not enough humor or presentation; if you go up to someone and do non stop card tricks over and over again your spectators have a right to slap you in the face. I believe Ricky Jay would be a great example of what I mean. If you can find it watch the HBO special "Ricky Jay and his 52 assistance" Its an entire tv special involving nothing but card tricks.

In my opinion based off of the above, its not the card's fault, or the fault of the genre of magic you specialize in. Its the performer's fault.

 

[Shodan]

It has become clear that this topic is less of a discussion and more of a soapbox for people who have decided that they know "the truth" about why card magic is inferior - as such, I have decided to stop wasting my energy!

Discussions on the internet are only productive if you actually consider and respond to other people's posts, rather than just restating your opinion over...and over...and over again. Sherlock, at least, has engaged in some debate with me but every time someone comes in here with a post of substance it gets ignored, and yet another arrogant "lecture" is posted informing us all of the error of our ways (followed of course by a series of "me too!" posts).

It reminds me of the old saying..."Those two speak, don't know...and those who know, don't speak."

Cheers,
David.

 

[tman93]

Why is this topic even here? Really? I mean it doesn't seem like people are actually debating the subject, yet rather just bashing card magic. Here's my view in it's simplest form. Keokesilverfang understands it in a sense. It is NOT about the cards. It is not the magic that we preform. It is who we are as a MAGICIAN that makes it magic. I can see how you magicians look around and go "Argh, all I see is card magic, this is ridiculous". Magic is not what it is because of so called "Tricks or card magic". It is created through the feeling that the spectator receives. That is what I feel magic is truly about. I personally as a magician only do card tricks because that's all I feel I need. Of course, this is not to say that I wouldn't like to try other forms of the art, but really it is the last of my worries. No matter what you have in your hands or what you use as your tool to bring across the feeling of wonder and mystique, it does not matter, just as long as you feel you are bringing the magic to the spectator. So I appreciate the argument, but I feel like most of you are missing what the point of magic really is. Now I want to note that I'm not saying this is how every magician should view magic, this is just my opinion and you can rightly view it as just that

-Tyler

 

[visualartist]

This is my post to steerpikes question recently quoted:

Your audience shouldn't care, if they are starting to care that you are only using cards then the magi is not giving their participants enough. By that I mean not enough humor or presentation; if you go up to someone and do non stop card tricks over and over again your spectators have a right to slap you in the face. I believe Ricky Jay would be a great example of what I mean. If you can find it watch the HBO special "Ricky Jay and his 52 assistance" Its an entire tv special involving nothing but card tricks.

In my opinion based off of the above, its not the card's fault, or the fault of the genre of magic you specialize in. Its the performer's fault.

You kind of missed the point. The question was what makes your card magic so special than all the other drones? IF you specialize solely on card magic that is. Ricky jay has character and is actually interesting to watch and listen to. But we arent talking to a bunch of ricky jays here. He was asking the "cardists" of this place.
Of course its not the cards themselves. No shiz.

 

[shadowlion63]

i agree with you. I perform alot of card tricks and a few tricks with money, and i like your idea about doing other tricks like making a burger out of no where, its just i dont know where to start getting the ideas for these miracles.
But great suggestion.

 

[Sherlock]

I don't understand why people think this is about bashing card magic. There are some great effects out there with cards, but you are a magician. Does a magician with work with cards only??? No he does amazing feats of levitation, makes fish appear, yet we manage to make their card appear upside down.

Please just think about, don't say I'm bashing because I have some crazy card effects I perform quite regularly now.

 

[tman93]

I don't understand why people think this is about bashing card magic. There are some great effects out there with cards, but you are a magician. Does a magician with work with cards only??? No he does amazing feats of levitation, makes fish appear, yet we manage to make their card appear upside down.

Please just think about, don't say I'm bashing because I have some crazy card effects I perform quite regularly now.

I didn't believe you guys were bashing cards. The way you guys are talking about this though, it comes across as if it's wrong to only do cards. If you are a magician, you truly understand why someone only works with certain types of things. Some magicians only do stage magic, some magicians only do coin magic. If the point of this thread is to discuss why a magician only does one type of magic, that's easy. A magician will only preform one type of magic because it is what he/she is most comfortable with. This is really nothing different then a magician who does cards and coins. In the end, they're basically the same thing, tricks. They are done with different objects, thus they seem different, but they're all based on the same ideology of the others. So only doing one type of magic is no different than doing several (but note, I'm not saying that it's the same in terms of the process, but rather just the concepts behind the trick, that concept being magic), it's all just how you view it.

 

[visualartist]

I didn't believe you guys were bashing cards. The way you guys are talking about this though, it comes across as if it's wrong to only do cards. If you are a magician, you truly understand why someone only works with certain types of things. Some magicians only do stage magic, some magicians only do coin magic. If the point of this thread is to discuss why a magician only does one type of magic, that's easy. A magician will only preform one type of magic because it is what he/she is most comfortable with. This is really nothing different then a magician who does cards and coins. In the end, they're basically the same thing, tricks. They are done with different objects, thus they seem different, but they're all based on the same ideology of the others. So only doing one type of magic is no different than doing several (but note, I'm not saying that it's the same in terms of the process, but rather just the concepts behind the trick, that concept being magic), it's all just how you view it.

You clearly havent understood the main purpose of the thread. Read through it again if you have to.

 

[tman93]

You clearly havent understood the main purpose of the thread. Read through it again if you have to.

I read your original post correctly, yes, and I liked the concept, but it seems the original idea became jumbled throughout the thread.

 

[visualartist]

I read your original post correctly, yes, and I liked the concept, but it seems the original idea became jumbled throughout the thread.

My second point comes across better in the message I quoted from ToyRobot. in the last few pages.

 

[tman93]

My second point comes across better in the message I quoted from ToyRobot. in the last few pages.

I stand corrected and completely agree. I'll make sure to read through threads thoroughly next time. I think that you're absolutely right about the fact that a fair amount of magicians will preform without keeping the concept that idea is to bring the feeling of magic through our art form, rather than just showing off sleights and skill. Sorry for misinterpreting the message here.

-Tyler

 

[visualartist]

I stand corrected and completely agree. I'll make sure to read through threads thoroughly next time. I think that you're absolutely right about the fact that a fair amount of magicians will preform without keeping the concept that idea is to bring the feeling of magic through our art form, rather than just showing off sleights and skill. Sorry for misinterpreting the message here.

-Tyler

Its fine,happens all the time. Especially in thread where sometimes people go on tangents. Hard to understand whats going on alot of times.

 

[Mike.Hankins]

I don't understand why people think this is about bashing card magic. There are some great effects out there with cards, but you are a magician. Does a magician with work with cards only??? No he does amazing feats of levitation, makes fish appear, yet we manage to make their card appear upside down.

Please just think about, don't say I'm bashing because I have some crazy card effects I perform quite regularly now.

SEE POST BELOW...I WROTE JUNK HERE...lol

 

[Mike.Hankins]

My second point comes across better in the message I quoted from ToyRobot. in the last few pages.

I think visualartist's first post can be summed up in just a few sentences...

If you are a magician, stop with the "Hey, look at this neat-o effect"...

Study up on HOW to present your magic. (The book Scripting for Magicians and the Fitzke Trilogy come to mind here...)

Give your magic substance, be it with cards, coins, sharks, midgets...whatever.

If you want to present a miracle, then learn how to present a miracle. If you want to present pure sleight of hand, then present it as such.

Maybe I am way left field...but that is what I got out of your post....

Mike

 

[visualartist]

I think visualartist's first post can be summed up in just a few sentences...

If you are a magician, stop with the "Hey, look at this neat-o effect"...

Study up on HOW to present your magic. (The book Scripting for Magicians and the Fitzke Trilogy come to mind here...)

Give your magic substance, be it with cards, coins, sharks, midgets...whatever.

If you want to present a miracle, then learn how to present a miracle. If you want to present pure sleight of hand, then present it as such.

Maybe I am way left field...but that is what I got out of your post....

Mike

Yeah thats it.
My beef is also with new card tricks of the past years. People are performing them and are being created just for the sake of being a trick.
Not even to be magical and certainly not to inspire audiences anymore.And many magicians gladly accept them because they require less work as a performer and concentrate almost solely on technicality.

 

[KeoSilver]

Either there I miss communicated or you missed my point.

You kind of missed the point. The question was what makes your card magic so special than all the other drones?
IF you specialize solely on card magic that is. Ricky jay has character and is actually interesting to watch and listen to. But we arent talking to a bunch of ricky jays here. He was asking the "cardists" of this place.
Of course its not the cards themselves. No shiz.

Addressing what is in yellow:

No I think I got the point completely, he wasn’t focusing just on “Cardists” he was focusing on everyone, if he wasn’t he would of said something about the drones because believe you me I know he used that term many times before. Hell my biggest slogan that I have and still abide by is this “I do not conform.” Quote by Nexus_Magic

He was asking the entire community what you do differently that makes your card magic not “suck”

I didn’t say I was talking about a bunch of Ricky Jays, I was using him as a supporting detail to my argument. Which is “Your audience shouldn't care, if they are starting to care that you are only using cards then the magician is not giving their participants enough.”

Then I fallowed that up with “I believe Ricky Jay would be a great example of what I mean. If you can find it watch the HBO special "Ricky Jay and his 52 assistance" Its an entire tv special involving nothing but card tricks.”

I do believe you missed my point and not the other way around.
Also the No shiz at the end of “Of course it’s not the cards themselves.” Is something I have come to expect from you.

My entire point, which is as follows,
“In my opinion based off of the above, its not the card's fault, or the fault of the genre of magic you specialize in."

I was clearly referring to cards and their genre of magic. Also I restated my point bluntly at the end, "Its the performer's fault.”